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Asking for feedback after a fly-out if not offered the job?

In our January “how can we help you?” thread, a reader asks, “Is it appropriate to ask for feedback after a flyout where you did not ultimately get the job?”

Another reader submitted the following reply, which seems right to me:

Not sure about appropriateness (I know HR at many places would not allow this especially by email), but about usefulness. Although it feels to candidates like these decisions are appraisals of how well we did, for committees it is often a close call between candidates who did equally well on the scorecard, such that the decision comes down to teaching or research “fit”, or things that could not be offered as reasons to the candidate’s face, such as personality, predictions about whether you’d stay, internal politics, whether someone in the room thought you were a total embarrassment, who the big cheese got behind. It seems probable you would get an incomplete explanation if you ask. Even if you do get constructive criticism of your performance, that should be discounted by the fact what place A dislikes might be exactly what place B is looking for, and we tend to overemphasize negative feedback internally. That is, because we are rejection sensitive, you may make changes to yourself or your candidacy to try to appeal more to that kind of place in future, when in fact that kind of place was not your best bet anyway. So it might be like asking someone why you didn’t get a second date — not that useful as information and likely to hurt your feelings!

What do other readers think? It could be especially helpful to hear from candidates who have asked for feedback, as well as from search committees/search chairs.

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5 responses to “Asking for feedback after a fly-out if not offered the job?”

  1. Anonymous

    I’m skeptical about the actionable value of feedback from flyouts. I say this as someone who has been moderately successful on the job market and asked for feedback along the way. I’ve also received unasked-for information about the “sausage-making process,” as it were. Here are my thoughts, which basically agrees with the initial reply and adds a bit more.

    1. Human beings are not always good at knowing what they’re responding to when they make decisions. That includes philosophers. So, you’re using someone’s self-report about the basis for their judgment, which may not be accurate.

    2. The person you get input from may not appreciate why others make their decisions for the same reason.

    3. People may not be at liberty to share what actually went into the decision. I have had many, many cases of people privy to decisions sharing that factors that are not supposed to be weighed were unofficially weighed (race, gender, etc.). Whether that was in fact the case, I don’t know. But *if* that’s part of the decision-making, it won’t help anyone to know (it isn’t actionable), and it certainly won’t be something that will be shared. And of course, local politics is always a feature.

    4. Finally, suppose, based on one flyout, you decide to change X. It is no guarantee that everyone at the next institution will be responsive to X in the same way. I’ve seen philosophers argue over whether a job candidate’s work even counts as philosophy. Sharing disagreement that basic isn’t going to be helpful to a candidate.

    Personally, I think input from friends and colleagues based on talks in other contexts, your general demeanor at conferences, etc., is going to be most helpful. Unfortunately, hiring practices involve a great deal of luck.

    Reply
  2. Anonymous

    I beg to differ. It can indeed be fruitless and pointless to ask, because committees sometimes make a decision based on extra-academic factors, such as established connections between a candidate and the faculty. Or it could be the case, as the other comments note, that the chair of the committee doesn’t want to disclose internal discussions, or that he or she simply doesn’t know why faculty voted a certain way.

    However, sometimes you can obtain essential information that changes the way you approach interviews. For example, just today I received feedback from a committee in a country where I had never been a finalist before. The feedback made me realize that the conventions in that country are slightly different from other academic cultures. If another opportunity comes up, I will certainly abide by that feedback, and I am quite confident that it will impact future job talks positively.

    Also, call me naive, but I do think that if you agree to a week-long intercontinental trip, the least you can expect from a committee is a sincere response to your efforts. I’ve never regretted asking for feedback.

    Reply
  3. Anonymous

    I suspect the 2nd comment is about a trip from the USA to Europe or the UK. It is only in the USA that people will be extremely reluctant to say much to candidates who did not get the job – and it is because of the litigious culture in the USA. Where I worked in the USA, the administration were terrified of being sued (mostly because of the bad press, but also because of the costs). So we were forbidden to say anything.
    I did, long long ago, ask for feedback. And at least one person I contacted was very decent, and told me something like, “your file was good, just publish more and in better places”.
    If you are in the USA, then I would not bother asking for feedback. Most of the time, people’s hands are tied

    Reply
  4. Anonymous

    I’ve been on the market for several years and been a finalist for jobs in multiple countries. I’ve sometimes had committee members offer me (unsolicited) feedback about why I didn’t receive an offer. This feedback has always been among the following:

    -Something from my dossier which is not now under my control was weaker than other applicants
    -I did not sufficiently stress something idiosyncratic to that search
    -The committee had an internal disagreement about who to proceed with
    -The committee wanted to hire me, but had many qualified applicants and only funding for one person

    In general, while I appreciate the sentiment of offering feedback, this information has not been actionable by me in the sense of altering my future applications or interviews. So I’ve never seen the point of reaching out to ask for feedback when it isn’t volunteered.

    I can also imagine committee members being annoyed by such inquiries. If there is a cultural practice or policy of offering feedback to candidates, then they should do this unprompted, and if there is a cultural practice or policy against offering feedback then they may feel put in an awkward position if you ask.

    Reply
  5. Anonymous

    There are ways to phrase the ask for feedback that I cannot imagine doing any harm (e.g., brief, receptive). And there are ways to take the feedback or the lackof that I cannot imagine doing any harm. For example, even if “It is no guarantee that everyone at the next institution will be responsive to X in the same way.” You at least know that some institution is responsive in this way that may apply to similar institutions/faculties.

    But how beneficial is it such that it is worth your time and mental energy? Not clear, for all the reasons that are commented.

    From the point of view of the hiring side, some candidates can definitely benefit from feedback, while others can’t and needn’t (they are good enough and eminently hirable by some other place). But tbh, even for those who can benefit the most, I am not sure I would be able to phrase my feedback in a way that does not offend them or is uncontroversially appropriate.

    Reply

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